complaining about their broadcasting ads touting serial scammer Ty Coughlin’s reverse funnel system. I was surprised that a seemingly reputable mainstream radio station would tout such garbage.
The sales manager wrote back advising me how this was an “alternate” and legitimate means of generating multiple streams of income that was so powerful, he had just signed up himself, and would soon be ringing in the cash.
It is kind of like when the aliens take over the bodies of humans.
The last time I saw their book, they had some crystal type stuff. kitchen stuff and stuff for the home. It was expensive. I haven’t heard anything about htem in several years so I didn’t even know they were still around.
If you wanna go for the social aspect, that’s fine… but if you do feel pressured by sales pitches, then don’t go. I go to stuff like that when my friends host a party just to get out of the house. And if I see something worthwhile, I’ll get it, but I am able to tune out the “pressure” part of it because I’ve already heard it all before and I know the scoop on MLMs.
Hi – my friend just sent me an invitation to a PRincess House event. I haven’t had time to look up info on it and was wondering if this is anything MLM ish with lots of overpriced products with big markups or if this is something of value to go to. Am I getting pitched or pressured if I go?
And most MLMers aren’t supposed to talk to negative folks.
So do a little research on the product – then ask questions. Many MLMs have peripheral motivational organizations – and generally, their costs far exceed anything the participant can earn by selling the product. Point out negative websites and ask how that kind of information can be helpful (NOT!) in trying to build a business. Are the products found on ebay or craigslist, as disgruntled participants seek to dump their inventories at below-cost prices?? (Again – this can make building a business fairly difficult)
Does your cousin talk about “dreams” – something used to divert one’s attention from the dwindling checkbook balance. There’s no place for “dreams” in a real business – just assets and liabilities and the bottom line.
From reading this forum and others, I’ve come to the conclusion that some people are “Motivational Junkies” and like that artificial “high” found at meetings. And like an addict – there’s not much you can do to change their mind until they’re darn good and ready to listen.
1. It’s helpful to accept that you cannot talk her out of it with logic. The MLM training has it all covered -( everything from questioning your intentions and integrity to labeling you a loser).
2.If she is like most MLMers (I haven’t known but 1 or 2, so this is second hand information), she will come out of it after significant losses and deflated, at which time you should help her get on her feet(not financially). Meanwhile, all you can do is ask some probing questions when you can(the idea is to feed into any doubts she may have herself from time to time)- if you can do it without seeming to come from an intellectually superior position.
3. I recently had a friend’s friend talk up some mlm and the “financial success” so much that I asked her to get back to me when she made her first million. That put an end to my recruitment :).
I’m not and never have been a MLMer, but my parents nearly a decade ago were into some water filter MLM which they ended up losing money on (roped in by friends) — when I brought it up at the time to my parents they yelled at me and called me an arrogant know-it-all (since they lost the money, proving me right, we’ve never talked about it), my aunt and uncle were part of Amway for many years…
Now jump to today…
My cousin (daughter of the Amwayers) has, in the last year, joined the World Ventures MLM. She is a young professional who just landed her first academic position this past year, and is a single mom. Every time my wife and I socialize with her, she works in the MLM somehow into every conversation, making it very uncomfortable. She routinely invites us to her “travel parties”, and has recently gotten her new boyfriend into the MLM.
My question is this: given my experience with my parents, I’m unconvinced that just saying “this is a scam” would result in anything positive occurring — resentment towards me, driving her deeper into the MLM community. What suggestions do MLM survivors have for those of us on the outside looking in? I want to be able to hang out with my cousin, but the MLM thing frankly creeps me (and my wife) out. Do all MLMers eventually learn that they were part of a scam? The other thing I’m worried about is how academics, who she may be pitching this to, would react — I would expect a fairly negative reaction to those who are more skeptical…
The reason I attacked your post is because it seems very dishonest and I have seen this exact thing many time before here by people that are are tying to promote or recuit to their MLM. You state that “We join the business actually to build wider network, keep in touch with friends while making some side-income, and unexpectedly we have earned at around USD 3000”.
You then state “to excell in this business is to be thick skin, positive thinking, persistant, and determined. Just keep introducing, if nobody wants, that’s alright, then move to find other new prospects”. So, you joined mostly to make new acquaintances and friends and accidentally made good money but you have to be thick skinned, positive, persistent and determined. To make new friends? Really?? You say your main purpose is to make new acquaintances/friends but if they don’t like your business you ditch them and just move on? Doesn’t sound very friendly to me. It might just be a cultural misunderstanding but this does not seem to me to be a good way to expand your social network of friends. If this is actually a `side’ income is it actually an income or just revenue? Is there any actual income after expenses? You also say that “Good things are we get to know more ppl with many different characters and from various business backgrounds, and learn new things from them”, but if you just ditch them and move on when they are not interested in your MLM what are you learning from them? I think you just came here to justify/promote/recruit to your MLM. I really don’t think that you could have picked a worse place to do this. This is not a place where we discuss what the best MLM is, it is a place where we discuss which is the worse. As Hal tells you, you might want to read the documents that were presented to you when you joined this blog.
who has bought into to their line of riches while you cure the world of every disease known to man.
Despite your experience, you still give them too much credit. From lotions and potions to my wife’s product – a magical material that will cure what ails you if you buy and wear enough of it all the time – they all exploit the people at the bottom. And if, as you say, they can move a lot of products, if a company really did have a product that were as good as they claim, wouldn’t it make more sense to sell boatloads to WalMart than to sell them one at a time through an untrained sales force of work at home soccer Moms?
By their very nature, MLMs are all scams. It is mathematically assured that most people in an MLM will lose money, and the facts are that over 99% do. Draw out a pyramid, and you will see that no matter what the size of a pyramid, there will always be more people in the very bottom rung, that in ALL of the rungs above it. At some point, any MLM runs out of bottom rungers, and the whole thing collapses, with the majority of people at the bottom and out of luck.
The comp plans are all designed to pay only the mega stars, while the rest are simply customers of overpriced, overhyped and mostly useless products.
This business model should be banned.
Good luck with your research.
My boyfriend and I joined MLM of FFI (used to stand for Fuel Freedom International but now recently it changed name to Forever Freedom Internatinal ) on March 08. We join the business actually to build wider network, keep in touch with friends while making some side-income, and unexpectedly we have earned at around USD 3000. Not bad at all. Don’t know about social-culture in other countries, but here in my own practice, I learn the key to excell in this business is to be thick skin, positive thinking, persistant, and determined. Just keep introducing, if nobody wants, that’s alright, then move to find other new prospects. Don’t let negative inputs from ppl get to you. Becoz this is our side income, so in case this is not successful, well that’s ok. Good things are we get to know more ppl with many different characters and from various business backgrounds, and learn new things from them.
The first was in the early 1970’s when I signed up as an Amway distributor. I didn’t last very long and swore off MLM totally after my one and only demonstartion for a prospect. She ended up buying the ost inexpensive item she could find just to get rid of me. I could actually see her thought process as she made the selection. It was humiliating.
Imagine my surprise when, 20 some odd years later I found myself at an opportunity meeting for ACN. I only went because the friend who invited me was someone I owed a favor to. I went in determined to say no. As they spun out the dream I clung to my Amway memories but as they kept hammering away with “there’s no box of soap to sell” my resolve agve way and I thought I can do this. I spent about 3 and half years chasing every prospect I could. Attending every quarterly meeting. Buying up all the latest recruiting tools. They always had new ones at every regional event.
Reality began to dawn as my residual checks never seemed to grow. The power of the hype began to lose it’s magic and I started to turn from a “red apple” to a “rotten apple”.
Today I am a freelance writer and I am working on a piece about MLM . It seems that this economy is probably a very fertile prospecting ground for these companies. I’m sure it’s a great way to move lots of product and services but I’ve yet to meet anyone who made an average living from this. The super stars of these companies are all millionaires. They seem to be the exceptions.
Would love to hear from anyone who’d like to share their stories. I am not interested in hearing about any new oppotunities. I have no interest in MLM except as it relates to the article I’mworking on. Please do not respond if your looking for prospects.
you still haven’t discovered that it’s not about how YOU perceive it but how it’s pitched to prospects? C’mon.
When employers look for people to hire, they put out a “help wanted” notice (a window sign, an ad in the paper or an announcement on radio or TV, etc.). The people who respond are total strangers, and if you’ve had more than 1 or 2 jobs, you know that some jobs are not completely friendly, to the employee or to the people with whom that employee associates. (Do you know anyone who’s ever worked in telemarketing? There’s a job that annoys a lot of people!)
When an MLM is pitched, they try to wrap it up in descriptions that resemble traditional business models and practices SO THAT it won’t sound like a scheme.
So once again, when you blame the victim (by calling them “naive”), you miss the point and possibly encourage scammers to keep going after those “naive” folks who don’t recognize what they’re doing, because even critics of MLM can’t figure out why the schemes work.
I got invited to ACN by someone I really trusted, and it took me about two years to get over it and out of it. Three if you count my rather slow journey out of a fairly dark pit it put me into.
I made it to ETT, almost ETL, but I ended up looking at some of the MLM information about other companies of long term installment loans with badcredit on the net and extrapolating to ACN. There’s hardly any information out there about them, and they could definitely use someone exposing them.
One of the really interesting things about ACN is that, while they are pretty careful to never actually lie to you, they are very good at misleading you. Heck, I got pretty good at misleading others, but at least I believed that it was good at the time. I got discouraged after seeing a bunch of my friends simply fail with it – it didn’t seem to me that a legitimate business would end up with everyone failing at it.
I have no idea how RVPs and SVPs can sleep at night. I recruited about 18 people myself and that still makes me sick to my stomach.
If you need any info on ACN, contact me.
if someone comes up with a great moneymaking idea, that they would share it with a bunch of strangers whose business model is to annoy their friends and family?
And would any business trust their credit card processing to some non-qualified person who just walked in the door? The reason 99% of MLMers fail to make any money is that there is usually no resale market for their products. Sometimes this is because of their ridiculous pricing, sometimes, like here, there just is no marketable product. Go sell some kind of magic jungle juice or potion – at least you can drink it yourself, which is what most MLMers end up doing.
These MLM’s are like Nigerian money transfer scams. Everyone knows they can’t be real, but enough greedy, misinformed people fall for it to keep them coming.
and with a well-known name behind it – selling credit-card services is TOUGH. I can’t imagine how impossible it would be to get an account based on a casual relationship with an unknown servicer.
My son-in-law is a sales rep for one of the largest card processors in the nation, and he attended school, then served as an “intern” before he was allowed to solicit business on his own. It has taken him 2
years to build a decent income from his accounts – and he works it 40+ hours per week.
The links John provided say it all – it’s simply a scam to get you to shell out lots of money for “leads”.
From what I’ve been reading, it’s a credit card processing company. The thing that raised red flags for me is that she states that they guarantee you will make $5000 in the first 90 days. How is this possible? Has anyone ever head of them? Here is the copy of the email I got:
“Would you be interested in looking at a legit business where it is $271 to get in and $19.95 a month AND they guarantee $5,000 in your first 90 days, because they help you for first 90 days? AND if you don’t make $250.00 in your first year they have a money back guarantee. : -) In Writing……
You are right. This club is not a place for political discourse, but that does not mean it cannot be brought up from time to time. It is appropriate, however, to point out A/Q and its political/religious
Considering the right-leaning mindset of AQMO leaders, it should be expected that people would be surprised when an ad for their company and their “opportunity” shows up on a program like Countdown.
It is neither surprising nor against any rules to mention that here.
Most of them use ad agencies that “bundle” advertising deals for them. They would usually take the extreme step of turning down business only if the company in question is indicted or otherwise known to be a PR disaster.
In this case, I am positive (not certain) that it would be difficult to have these networks remove Quixtar. After all, OUR Elected government considers them a legit company. It pisses me off too, but some of these fights are harder than others …..
how quick people are to bring their partisan political beliefs into any argument they possibly can. Yes, I am aware that Dick Devos ran for governor as a republican and that Scamway leaders in general are pro-republican. So what? Scamway leaders are in general die hard Christians. Does that mean all Christians are implied to be evil? The Fox network doesn’t rip into those with conservative beliefs every chance they get so it is to be implied that they are in league with an evil that is to be named republican? I don’t think that making potentially offensive political or any other kind of slurs helps any of the discussions and healing that this site is intended to provide.
After all we’re here to dissect, dismantle and debase MLM’s aren’t ‘we? 🙂
I watch very little TV and had yet to see the Quixtar ad. As long as I know where to complain, I really did not need to see it. I already know they are a cult of thieves. I just needed to know for sure who dared to run the ad so I can make an inteligent complaint. I challange everyone to contact NBC or whoever dares to air the Quixtar lies. Thanks for the info and God bless. James
PS. I just called the 1-800 number on the video and gave the person who answered a 20 minute ear full of enlightenment. They actually seemed to listen. Maybe a seed of truth was planted. Who knows.
Yes, I’ve seen the ad. They’re also advertising in USA Today and Newsweek. It appears that they’re going for brand recognition. A good move, in my opinion, although they’ll never get very far with it until they divorce themselves from the MLM component of their business. It’s that part of it that has given them the “cult” reputation.
They sell lots of products, but the vast majority of that goes to the very people who are supposed to be selling it. And the tactics used to sell the products to those people are underhanded, at best.
Let A/Q compete in the open market, like everyone else, and see if they thrive or die.
Hope to hear more from you.
I have just seen a Quixtar(sp?) ad here in Texas on NBC. Could not believe it but for the fact that the economy is in the tank and the poor unsuspecting public is desparate. Has anyone else seen it?
By the way since I have never officially introduced myself, I am, Marvin Pasek from Irving, TX. Wasted about $40K (when you consider the “Nikken” cars I leased) in Nikken. Never in Quixtar but Nikken is no different from it or all the others.